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 Post subject: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2016 12:45 am 
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I thought I’d post a question to the group to generate some discussion.

So with the release of the players book we now have 10 official player professions to pick from, 13 if you spilt elementalist into its 4 good categories, 15 if you also include the dark option and the demonologist. However leaving out the darker options and treating the elementalist as one broad profession, I wondered what mix of professions people would like to see in group.

(Note: I have not included the Friar or the Thane in this as they are fan published house rules and not official professions)

So my question is, if you were living in Legend and wanted to recruit a group of 6 adventurers to go on any type of quest (ie needing a wide skill set) which 6 professions would you pick if you were restricted to only one of each type? Feel free to note the reasons behind your choices as well.

So let’s see what sort of mix we all come up with! Oh and if you do pick the elementalist can you please note which would be their main element.


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 Post subject: Re: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2016 2:06 am 
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Profession: Hunter
Elementalist ( Fire) - Cos burning stuff is fun...also they get social props in Glissom.
Knight- Cos its nice to have someone respectable around when the nobs start taking interest...also they can kill people.
Mystic- Stealth Spell Caster FTW. Also makes a decent wilderness scout.
Knave- For when you absolutely, positively need to talk your way out.
Assassin ( Burglar/Acrobat version)- Cos sometimes it pays to be quiet.


The 6th member is hard....I'm thinking you want someone researchy...which points to Priest or Sorcerer...guess it depends on the social circles of your group.

Now thats for a really varied group....Its also fun to have a whole party of Knights, or a Gang of Assassins and Knaves....

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 Post subject: Re: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:04 am 
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So what party would I pick?

Well to start with we’re going to need someone to do the dirty work
1. Knight, in a world where health points can vanish in a die roll, armour factor is everything. A dedicated fighter that starts the game with the best non-magical armour? Yes please.
2. Barbarian. Did I mention vanishing health points? How about a dedicated fighter with the highest start HPS and the second best non-magical armour? You’re in mate.

Now they need some back up
3. Sorcerer. Can burn/zap/kill things and can also heal your fighters. Want a killy medic. Tick.
4. Mystic. Has some very nice spells and abilities to assist the party in a variety of ways, starts with the third best armour so can help out in a “to do” if needed. But best of all is spell mastery, without having to pass a test they can automatically walk into a room and tell you what is enchanted and what isn’t. That is special.

So all of the original professions are in although without spell mastery the mystic may not have been as sure a bet. But now to round the party out.
5. Assassin. The most skilled of the professions (well they have a lot to pick from) have attack value equal to a knight, have some nice combat skills for when things get up close and personal, all those stealth abilities for when you need to be subtle, and the thieving skills (including picklock which no one else has). Use to be a must have when no-one else had track but still retains their value under the updated rules.
6. Warlock. I love my cricket and I love all-rounders the most. The warlock is the dw all-rounder. Attack and defence increase at the same rate as a pure fighter, has some powerful spells to back it up including healing spells (killy medic number two) and starts with the second best non-magical armour. Welcome aboard.

So why not the others?
Elementalist. Water is my favourite element for that call lighting. I want one in their but I can only take six. If the mystic wasn’t updated to have spell mastery this would have made the cut. Just misses out.

Hunter. Again I want one in this party. A long bow using precise shot is amazing, add in shooting twice a round at higher ranks and it is deadly. Those extra skills of the assassin just kept this one out. Just.

Priest. I like the priest but the book learner role is already taken care of by the sorcerer. The priest does have some nice skills, exorcism especially, but unless you’re facing demons every other week they just lack punch. This professions just needs a little more oomph to make the cut. How about some abilities against undead or fey?
Knave. I want this profession to work but it’s basically a less killy assassin with less skills but good chat up lines. That was a little tongue in cheek but you get the idea. Like the priest I think this one just needs a little more punch to be considered.


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 Post subject: Re: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2016 9:02 am 
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6 Kurland barbarians. Think of the chaos... They called the Vandals for a good reason.... Even the Selentine empire was brought on its knees...

http://www.history.com/news/6-infamous-sacks-of-rome


They'll just trash any underwurlde, take all the gold and carry away all the females....

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 Post subject: Re: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2016 1:45 am 
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Personally I like running groups composed of only one or two Professions as it enables things to be a bit more focused; for instance a group of Cataphracts and their Priests, or a questing band of Mercanian Barbarians/Hunters and their Skald ( Knave). I did run a short investigative scenario for a trio of Gliss Druids which was very fun.

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co-author Fury of the Deep
co-author Friends or Foes
co-author Dragon Warriors Players Guide
co-author Cold Fury
co-author Cadaver Draconis
co-author Ordo Draconis 1 and 2.


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 Post subject: Re: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2016 5:38 am 
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yeah those groups are fun, taking off the "only one of each type" limit I'd go for 3 knights, 2 sorcerers and a barbarian.

I just wondered what peoples top 6 professions may be, 6 being the standard party size quoted at the beginning of most scenarios.

I guess I could have alternatively just asked for people to rate each profession in order!


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 Post subject: Re: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2016 5:43 am 
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Make another thread.;)

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co-author Friends or Foes
co-author Dragon Warriors Players Guide
co-author Cold Fury
co-author Cadaver Draconis
co-author Ordo Draconis 1 and 2.


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 Post subject: Re: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2016 5:48 am 
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Profession: Barbarian
To play? A cowardly assassin! He'll run off by himself to get first picks on all the loot and then need the party to save him. A bit like Loge....

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 Post subject: Re: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:00 am 
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To be effective in a broad range of situations, a 6-character party needs to cover all of its bases - social, magic, combat, exploration, and investigation. And all character professions can be useful in any of those situations (magic's perhaps the hardest situation in which non-magickers can be useful, but it's a poorly written adventure that requires a specific adventuring profession to be present in a party).

A comparison of which professions are better, though, is unfair, as the later professions follow very different design principles to the earlier professions, and the early professions have not been retrofitted with those principles in mind. Two obvious examples are the knight and the knave, both of whom have exceptional social advantages, but only with the knave is this reflected in the rules. Similarly, for the two scholarly professions, sorcerer and priest, only the priest's scholarly lore represented by any rules.

Professions in Dragon Warriors are not balanced, they are not equivalent, nor are the skills all useful. Instead, they are based on evocative archetypes that a player may want to play, regardless of how useful or otherwise they may be during an adventure - that's the job of the GM, to sculpt an adventure that gives every character an opportunity to shine. If you have a DW party where the knight does all the fighting, the assassin does all the sneaking, the knave does all the talking, and the sorcerer just spends MP on healing the party then you might as well be playing D&D. In a nutshell, DW professions have character, as opposed to characters having a profession.

But, that little rant aside, if I was in-game and had to recruit a varied set of 6 adventuring professionals without knowing anything about the adventure on which they were being sent, and assuming they were all 1st rank, then I'd have the following:

1) Knight - every party needs a leader, almost all adventures are going to need (at least one) strong combatant (best AF in the game, and AF is perhaps the biggest factor in keeping a character alive at early ranks), and the knight's social advantages can be very useful in non-underworld settings.
2) Sorcerer - covering the next base, magic, few can hold a candle to what a sorcerer can accomplish with magic - even at first rank, a sorcerer can blast enemies with fire, heal the wounded, illuminate the darkness, deceive with illusion, and pick locks (sort of ;)). You can't really ask for much more from anyone!
3) Assassin - most adventures will take characters into the underworlds, where exploration skills are essential - I'm not fussed about the assassin's various combat abilities, but at first rank the assassin could have two exploration abilities, such as climb, jump, pick locks, and let's not overlook his ability to sneak, which has a plethora of adventuring applications.

So, the first half of the party was easy enough, but the next half requires a little bit more thought - remembering that we have 6 slots of 1st rank adventurers, there are three obvious comparisons to make:

4) Barbarian or Hunter
The barbarian is a faultless fighter and tracker, with good armour, high health points, and exceptional combat skills. However, the hunter brings exceptional ranged combat ability, and some stealth skills to back-up the assassin. Additionally, his foraging skills mean that any possibly reason you'd like to have a low-level elementalist around (i.e,. for the food and water spells, and possibly the ranged attacks) goes away.

5) Mystic or Warlock
We can't leave all of the magic to the sorcerer. We have 6 slots to fill, so we can have a bit of redundancy. Elementalists have very few spells and, at first level, may not be able to afford an elemental focus, which scuppers their spellcasting in their secondary elements at first rank and also means they'll only be able to cast their first level spell from their primary element once per day. Even then the low-level spells are a bit feeble. So that leaves the mystic and warlock. The mystic's chief advantage is to be able to See Enchantment as an always-on ability. Even a sorcerer cannot detect magic until 2nd rank. However, the warlock can detect magic at first rank, heal others (combat is deadly, so you can never have too much healing, and the mystic may only heal himself), and brings some much-needed extra fighting ability to the party. So I'd go with warlock.

6) Priest or Knave
Having filled the first 5 slots and balanced our party pretty well, we have the luxury of a sixth slot, which means we can be pretty specialist with our selection - both priest and knave bring additional social benefits to those provided by having a knight in the party, but their skills each have a very different focus that makes direct comparison difficult. Priests can contribute their knowledge and language skills and knaves, by choosing starting skills that do not overlap with the assassin, can also fit very well with a party (and could bring language skills, too, like the priest). I'd be tempted to choose knave over priest, simply because the +1 per rank for Looks rolls is going to become a phenomenal advantage to the group and, as this is a 'luxury' pick, I can afford to play the long game by choosing knave.

So how have I done covering my bases? I have knight and knave for social, sorcerer and warlock for magic, knight, barbarian and hunter for combat, assassin and hunter for exploration, and assassin and knave for investigation.

Why no elementalists? Too few spells and not enough distinction to give them a role that cannot be covered by the other professions. The only reason to play an elementalist, as a player, is if you want to play an elementalist because it's an elementalist.

Of course, it's a very different exercise when looking at hiring an experienced bunch of adventurers or have a smaller party to take adventuring...

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 Post subject: Re: Pick Your Party
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:05 am 
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Damian May wrote:
Personally I like running groups composed of only one or two Professions as it enables things to be a bit more focused; for instance a group of Cataphracts and their Priests, or a questing band of Mercanian Barbarians/Hunters and their Skald ( Knave). I did run a short investigative scenario for a trio of Gliss Druids which was very fun.

A party of apprentice sorcerers, all apprenticed to Ulric, who has challenged them to bring him back a magical treasure worthy of his collection - they have to work together to achieve their goal, but whomever brings it to him is obviously going to be Ulric's favourite, so there's a bit of healthy competition going on there, too :twisted:

Balancing the social challenges of being a party of sorcerers, which is going to make anyone twitchy, not exhausing your spells, complementing but also competing with one another for Ulric's patronage, and exploring the dangerous wildernesses and underworlds in which a suitable arcane treasure might be found could be an interesting campaign! Set in and around the Jewelspider Woods, at the mercy of the fey, the elements, and the abominations that stalk the forest for unwary travellers...

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